# Minnesota regulation changes



## MN Divers

https://www.dnr.state.mn.us/wildlife/waterfowl/waterfowl-public-input.html

I'm surprised I haven't seen this posted yet, but MN decided to change some regulations this year due to the waterfowl survey people could participate in. One of the biggest changes I'm excited for is EARLY TEAL! We finally get an early teal season. Basically every thing they implemented I am excited for and support, like no 4pm closure, and the goose bag limit from 3 to 5.


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## SkolMNDuckHunter

There are a couple of threads on the original surveys and then on the follow up that alluded to what was changed. Scroll down like 8 threads.


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## Neighbor Guy

Early teal will be a cluster bleep. 

You guys can have it. My hope is it gets some of the morons out of the swamp on the regular opener. Most who hunt it won’t be able to ID their birds until they are in hand, so there will be a lot of cattail birds as well. 

The only reason MN has one now is because the teal never showed up for the early teal season down south last fall. This will guarantee they are driven south for their season. 

Hunting all day, fine, but don’t complain when you shoot birds coming to roost and don’t have birds using your spots the next day. 

5-geese all season, great, all for it. 

Any changes that don’t include an expanded/state wide sandhill crane season is a slap in the face of every farmer and waterfowl hunter who spends all spring, summer, and fall looking at giant flocks of birds damaging crops.


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## SkolMNDuckHunter

Neighbor Guy said:


> Early teal will be a cluster bleep.
> 
> You guys can have it. My hope is it gets some of the morons out of the swamp on the regular opener. Most who hunt it won’t be able to ID their birds until they are in hand, so there will be a lot of cattail birds as well.
> 
> The only reason MN has one now is because the teal never showed up for the early teal season down south last fall. This will guarantee they are driven south for their season.
> 
> Hunting all day, fine, but don’t complain when you shoot birds coming to roost and don’t have birds using your spots the next day.
> 
> 5-geese all season, great, all for it.
> 
> Any changes that don’t include an expanded/state wide sandhill crane season is a slap in the face of every farmer and waterfowl hunter who spends all spring, summer, and fall looking at giant flocks of birds damaging crops.


Exactly this. I love the 5 goose limit all year. GIVE US CRANE HUNTING! 
The rest I can take or leave.


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## Rogue Hunter

Crane season...state wide.


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## MJ1657

It's no question the crane are hard on our corn crop. The issue we are dealing with now is the damage they are doing to our alfalfa. There are so many of them they are walking it down.


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## Full Force Five

I’ve never understood the duck ID argument when it come to a real season. Are there honestly duck hunters that can’t tell a wood duck from a teal, especially a BWT?


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## Neighbor Guy

^^^ YES ^^^

You would be shocked at how many shoot first and ID later. I would say the majority of those who only hunt a weekend or two a season. 

Heck, a large number of those who hunt all year just know it’s a duck and then ID after it’s in the bag.


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## SkolMNDuckHunter

Full Force Five said:


> I’ve never understood the duck ID argument when it come to a real season. Are there honestly duck hunters that can’t tell a wood duck from a teal, especially a BWT?


I would bet money half of the idiots out there with a shotgun the first 2 weeks couldn't tell you which duck flew by if that's all they tried to do. Forget shooting. Unless it quacks maybe.


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## Paul Myrdahl

I think you guys might be over thinking this a little. I find it hard to believe these slob hunters will out hunting labor day weekend. I may be wrong but my guess is they'll have different plans.


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## Bullet21XD

I'll be out...shooting ducks!


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## Paul Myrdahl




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## wooduck26

Neighbor Guy said:


> The only reason MN has one now is because the teal never showed up for the early teal season down south last fall. This will guarantee they are driven south for their season.



Did you shoot a lot of Bluewings at the end of the MN season?


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## Bullet21XD

wooduck26 said:


> Did you shoot a lot of Bluewings at the end of the MN season?


They all went north last year. They took the long route.


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## Paul Myrdahl

End of the season? How about the beginning because they are usually gone from where I hunt before the regular opening.


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## GK1

Damn duck hunters are stupid.


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## RingbillRon

The early Teal Season is a much needed change. Not sure how a true duck hunter could be against it. Massive amounts of Blue wings leave this state or migrate through before the regular opener.

Dennis Anderson's latest article couldn't be more wrong. 

I Will hunt the teal season, YWD with my son and daughter, and the regular opener and couldn't be more excited - Especially since our trip to Argentina got cancelled this month due to COVID.


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## snowgooseman

Like the changes. My dad is excited he has been waiting over 70 years for early teal season so gives me another few days to hunt with him.


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## RingbillRon

snowgooseman said:


> Like the changes. My dad is excited he has been waiting over 70 years for early teal season so gives me another few days to hunt with him.



Yeah, my Dad participated in the last MN Teal hunt which I think was 1963??? He will be out there this year.


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## DRKESLYER

While I consider myself a true duck hunter I guess that’s subjective. I don’t like the idea of a teal opener because of a number of reasons. I read once that in wisoconsin they estimated 40-50% of birds shot at we’re not teal. I get places like Kansas that get loads of teal and then wait a significant time for birds from the ppr to show up but Minnesota is different being a lot of ducks we shoot are taken early in the season and most likely local ducks. We are going to rely on the same place we’re shooting teal to hopefully hold mallards and woodducks soon after our teal season?
I can’t believe how MN has taken over the gloves off all in the name of hunter recruitment and opportunity. Maybe i am getting older and probably spend more time hunting the central flyway than MN but is there any interest as whole in producing more quality over quantity hunting? I know it’s a dry as it’s been in a while but my guess is there will be a lot of hunters who don’t fire a shell on opening day this year.


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## snowgooseman

I doubt that, scout and you will have no problems


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## Bullet21XD

I'm expecting the places i'll be killing teal during the early season will be full of teal by the opener.


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## snowgooseman

Agreed 100 percent bullet


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## Paul Myrdahl

The places I'll be hunting teal are usually void of teal by the opener. Blue wings that is. Green wings are few and far between during the season.


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## KENNEDY63

DRKESLYER said:


> I can’t believe how MN has taken over the gloves off all in the name of hunter recruitment and opportunity. Maybe i am getting older and probably spend more time hunting the central flyway than MN but is there any interest as whole in *producing more quality over quantity hunting*?



Spot on.

As an old guy with younger kids - I really don't bother taking my kids out much - which means that the MN DNR is missing the boat on recruitment, license fees, Delta and DU don't have my kids at banquets, etc. etc.

Examples of why: 

1. Hunted a public slough for YWD last year. This particular body of water has ALWAYS (say, over the past 20 years) held a good number of teal and wood ducks early season, as it can be somewhat of a ball buster to get into. Last year, some over the water goose hunters found an easy way in and, by the look of things, had been there before. Total shots fired by 2 youth hunters - 3. Total number of ducks seen - 7.

2. Going back to the mid 70s when I had my first shooting based outing as a youth (during the "terrible" noon opener - 4 pm closure days), I remember the first Sunday of opening weekend that I was allowed to shoot. I was using a Remington 1100, and was allowed to have 1 shell in the gun. 63 shells later, I finalized my first duck limit. Total ducks seen - hundreds if not thousands.

The race towards never ending "opportunity" as it relates to waterfowl hunting is killing the sport. This season should be interesting.


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## SkolMNDuckHunter

KENNEDY63 said:


> Spot on.
> 
> As an old guy with younger kids - I really don't bother taking my kids out much - which means that the MN DNR is missing the boat on recruitment, license fees, Delta and DU don't have my kids at banquets, etc. etc.
> 
> Examples of why:
> 
> 1. Hunted a public slough for YWD last year. This particular body of water has ALWAYS (say, over the past 20 years) held a good number of teal and wood ducks early season, as it can be somewhat of a ball buster to get into. Last year, some over the water goose hunters found an easy way in and, by the look of things, had been there before. Total shots fired by 2 youth hunters - 3. Total number of ducks seen - 7.
> 
> 2. Going back to the mid 70s when I had my first shooting based outing as a youth (during the "terrible" noon opener - 4 pm closure days), I remember the first Sunday of opening weekend that I was allowed to shoot. I was using a Remington 1100, and was allowed to have 1 shell in the gun. 63 shells later, I finalized my first duck limit. Total ducks seen - hundreds if not thousands.
> 
> The race towards never ending "opportunity" as it relates to waterfowl hunting is killing the sport. This season should be interesting.


Two issues with your post. 
1. You don't take your own kids out, but it's the DNR that's failing at recruitment? 

2. Think of the continual loss of opportunity they have to battle against. You used to be able hunt any old farm pothole you wanted to in general. Now, most of them are tiled and plowed, and private access is rare or expensive. Most people's only other option is the few public spots. No sh** they get shot out.


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## KENNEDY63

SkolMNDuckHunter said:


> Two issues with your post.
> 1. You don't take your own kids out, but it's the DNR that's failing at recruitment?
> 
> 2. Think of the continual loss of opportunity they have to battle against. You used to be able hunt any old farm pothole you wanted to in general. Now, most of them are tiled and plowed, and private access is rare or expensive. Most people's only other option is the few public spots. No sh** they get shot out.



1. Kids can see sunrises and the other wonders associated with duck hunting in their back yard or the local park. So, that begs the question - why go through the hassle of duck hunting if the ducks ain't there because the teal guys and the goose guys got there first?

2. It's interesting that you choose the word "battle", as I've never thought of duck hunting being some kind of battle that must be won. I always kind of thought of it as something fun to participate in. But yes - given the over access to the resource - it has become somewhat of a battle.

In the time since my initial duck hunt, this state has added innumerable public hunting properties, while losing about half of its duck hunters. What's changed the most? The expansion of "hunting opportunities" in the name of recruitment/increased revenue streams. Open all waterfowl hunting on the last weekend of September or the first weekend of October, close at 4 (or rotate open-closed areas) to keep birds around - 2 very simple methods for improving the quality of waterfowl hunting.


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## SkolMNDuckHunter

KENNEDY63 said:


> 1. Kids can see sunrises and the other wonders associated with duck hunting in their back yard or the local park. So, that begs the question - why go through the hassle of duck hunting if the ducks ain't there because the teal guys and the goose guys got there first?
> 
> 2. It's interesting that you choose the word "battle", as I've never thought of duck hunting being some kind of battle that must be won. I always kind of thought of it as something fun to participate in. But yes - given the over access to the resource - it has become somewhat of a battle.
> 
> In the time since my initial duck hunt, this state has added innumerable public hunting properties, while losing about half of its duck hunters. What's changed the most? The expansion of "hunting opportunities" in the name of recruitment/increased revenue streams. Open all waterfowl hunting on the last weekend of September or the first weekend of October, close at 4 (or rotate open-closed areas) to keep birds around - 2 very simple methods for improving the quality of waterfowl hunting.


I have no idea how you could be an "old guy" duck hunting in MN and think that the only thing that's changed is season structure. 
You know what would make hunting easier? 

If the western half of our state didn't have 90% of our historic prairie potholes under corn. 

If every single lake wasn't ringed by mansions with putting green lawns and beaches instead of cattails and bull rushes.

If land access was still easy to come by and you could actually hunt the birds and not the few spots you have left.


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## KENNEDY63

SkolMNDuckHunter said:


> I have no idea how you could be an "old guy" duck hunting in MN and think that the only thing that's changed is season structure.
> You know what would make hunting easier?
> 
> If the western half of our state didn't have 90% of our historic prairie potholes under corn.
> 
> If every single lake wasn't ringed by mansions with putting green lawns and beaches instead of cattails and bull rushes.
> 
> If land access was still easy to come by and you could actually hunt the birds and not the few spots you have left.



Actually - I never said that "_the only thing that has changed is season structure_" - so, there is that....

Anyway, we are getting way off topic, so to right the ship - what has happened to hunter numbers after the addition of hunting geese in August, hunting geese over water, having an early teal season, having a youth waterfowl day, etc. etc. etc.? I mean - with "expanded opportunity", we should be seeing a bunch more duck hunters, right?

If we truly want more hunters and more ducks - think that it might be time to re-examine the state mandated recruitment/revenue philosophy of having people killing birds in the swamps for roughly 5 months?

The lack of creative thinking on the part of most duck hunters (take comfort that you aren't alone) and and the DNR folks relative to this topic is mind boggling.......


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## snowgooseman

Recruiting new waterfowlers starts with the parents where alot of them have views as to not go because of no place to go, no shells in stores, see sunrise in back yard etc. How many kids today would rather sit on the tablets, computer, etc than enjoy the outdoors. The more opportunities allowed will hopefully entice more hunters to the field.


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## woodiefanatic

Teal season’s awesome. If you don’t like it don’t go. More for the rest of us. Shortening the season won’t make your duck hunting any better. The amount of available habit remaining is less every year and it is more easily exploited with modern mapping and better equipment. Just the reality of the it.


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## SkolMNDuckHunter

KENNEDY63 said:


> Actually - I never said that "_the only thing that has changed is season structure_" - so, there is that....
> 
> Anyway, we are getting way off topic, so to right the ship - what has happened to hunter numbers after the addition of hunting geese in August, hunting geese over water, having an early teal season, having a youth waterfowl day, etc. etc. etc.? I mean - with "expanded opportunity", we should be seeing a bunch more duck hunters, right?
> 
> If we truly want more hunters and more ducks - think that it might be time to re-examine the state mandated recruitment/revenue philosophy of having people killing birds in the swamps for roughly 5 months?
> 
> The lack of creative thinking on the part of most duck hunters (take comfort that you aren't alone) and and the DNR folks relative to this topic is mind boggling.......


Seems like you're the one that can't think big picture, rather than we that lack creative thinking. Without expanding opportunity there would be even less hunters than there currently are. There are a thousand reasons hunter numbers are declining, and loss of habitat and hunting access are the biggest 2.

You can't "keep birds around" once you become a flyover state, or in our case a fly a bit further west state. Pressure over any period of time is not even close to the biggest reason we see poor duck hunting. Our state has no reason for migrating ducks to stick around for. We've eliminated our pothole habitat, our good duck feeds, the entirety of natural shorelines on lakes. Without that stuff, keeping hunters at home does not make the ducks want to be here any more than they do now.


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## KENNEDY63

snowgooseman said:


> The more opportunities allowed will hopefully entice more hunters to the field.



So - in the real world (as opposed to world of "hoping") - how's that been working out? The numbers don't lie - waterfowl hunter recruitment during the age of YWD and increased "opportunities" has been an abject failure.


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## Bullet21XD

One could definitely think that with the increased opportunity, the more hunters would be enticed to the sport. Other points mentioned regarding access could also have exactly the opposite effect.

Both are very valid points.

Personally, I glad for the teal season. Will it have a negative effect? We don't know that. From what i've seen, it has not in Wisconsin. That may vary for others, or even the majority of Wi hunters, but I haven't heard much on the topic. Early goose...IMO, benefits very few, and I can't believe serves any purpose regarding recruitment.

I'll like the teal season, regardless of the outcome. I do like the early openers, simply because I don't believe our duck season should be open later than Thanksgiving. I would be fine opening a week later and dropping any splits. We don't really need to have a duck season that spans 75-80 days, when the last 2 weeks of the season, we are often covered in snow and ice, with few ducks and marginal opportunities...if any.

Ultimately though, i'm going duck hunting when the season is open. Some seasons are easy. Some are difficult. This one could be a tough one...but i'm still going.


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## Bullet21XD

SkolMNDuckHunter said:


> You can't "keep birds around" once you become a flyover state, or in our case a fly a bit further west state. Pressure over any period of time is not even close to the biggest reason we see poor duck hunting. Our state has no reason for migrating ducks to stick around for.



This is a very inaccurate assessment. Places I hunt that receive little hunting pressure hold ducks until they freeze. Go to Big Rice, or Swan, or drive western Mn 2 days before the season and tell me there's no good duck habitat. Hunting pressure hasn't appeared to ease with the decreased number of hunters. And hunting pressure is the biggest factor...if people aren't out killing a few ducks, and running the rest out...there'd be tons of ducks in Mn until it freezes. This is the biggest reason I hate afternoon hunting, and wish the state would take measures to prevent it.


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## prairie hunter

Recruitment or retention ?? 

DNR is trying to stop the drop in waterfowl stamp sales. Pure recruitment and retention will only be accomplished when the average guy can go shoot a few ducks without being crowded, sworn at, or worse (sprayed/peppered/rained). Urban kids (or even adults) have too many other activites and full weekend (or longer) trips cannot be sustained weekly. Flipp'n travel hockey is an October sport. Rural kids (or adults) have competing activities and getting pushed off (leased land, etc) doesn't help. Add in scouting and the time magnifies considerably.

Plenty of die-hard waterfowlers are still around and they often hunt even more days ... not less.  The opening weekend warriors do not want to put up with all the crap and chose to fish, bow hunt, golf, chill in the backyard with a few beers. On really good seasons a few extra stamps are sold to guys that tag along with die-hards. I think that is especially true of pheasant hunters. If the pheasant hunting is good ... friends and family buy a stamp and go along for a day or two.

*I always thought YWD is also about recruiting people to at least be cognizant of the fact that most hunters are not ***holes. If there are people out there that get to go on mentored hunts for waterfowl, deer, turkey, etc... and walk away as either pro-hunting or accepting it ... then mission is accomplished.*


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## SkolMNDuckHunter

Bullet21XD said:


> This is a very inaccurate assessment. Places I hunt that receive little hunting pressure hold ducks until they freeze. Go to Big Rice, or Swan, or drive western Mn 2 days before the season and tell me there's no good duck habitat. Hunting pressure hasn't appeared to ease with the decreased number of hunters. And hunting pressure is the biggest factor...if people aren't out killing a few ducks, and running the rest out...there'd be tons of ducks in Mn until it freezes. This is the biggest reason I hate afternoon hunting, and wish the state would take measures to prevent it.


People in Minnesota tend to think there's ducks if you and buddy can scratch a limit. The Dakotas get plenty of pressure too, but you can still find tornado mallard feeds. I've never seen ducks on that scale at any point in MN.


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## Bullet21XD

You don't get around much.


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## RingbillRon

It seems like the Dennis Anderson crew is hyper-focused on the "Opener" and they want to protect that one weekend by getting rid of all of the other earlier opportunities. If you only hunt that weekend I can't disagree with that opinion. For those of us that hunt a lot I would rather take advantage of all the opportunities that we have. 

Selfishly, I would like to see all hunting in MN closed at 1pm all season up until the last week and closed hunting on all WMA's Monday's, Tuesday's and Thursday's.


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## Beaverpond

Dennis Anderson IS only an opening weekend guy. He goes and hunts the same crappy spot every opening weekend, gets the same crappy results, and then complains about how there’s no ducks.


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## RingbillRon

Beaverpond said:


> Dennis Anderson IS only an opening weekend guy. He goes and hunts the same crappy spot every opening weekend, gets the same crappy results, and then complains about how there’s no ducks.



Don't forget about the annual December river canoe goose hunt with his buddy and his Russian bride...


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## KENNEDY63

prairie hunter said:


> Plenty of die-hard waterfowlers are still around and they often hunt even more days ... not less.



If that is the case (and I agree with your sentiment) - then why aren't those guys paying more in the form of enhanced license fees? The DNR is always looking for more revenue.....hence the drive for "hunter recruitment".


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## KENNEDY63

*One could definitely think that with the increased opportunity, the more hunters would be enticed to the sport.* Yes, one could certainly think that, but the facts are not on their side.

*Will it have a negative effect? We don't know that.* I agree. But we do agree that pressure kicks birds out. We shall see.

Couple years old - but you get the idea. I can tell you that 1 barrier is the hunter safety requirement. Kids in my family start to handle firearms at a young age - they should be allowed to test out, or have most learning done on line.

*DNR: Number of Minnesota hunters stays on the decline*
JESSE WHITE OUTDOORS COLUMNIST

The results of a recent Department of Natural Resources survey of small game hunters shows that the number of Minnesota hunters continues to decline.

Small game license sales have been trending down for the past two decades, officials said, as fewer hunters hit the woods each fall to chase game like grouse, waterfowl and squirrels.

The DNR has been keeping track of such information since 1969.

“The trend is nationwide,” said Tom Rusch, DNR Wildlife Manager for the Tower area. “These are societal changes. They have been occurring for decades.”

According to DNR figures, in 1999, 327,400 small game licenses were sold compared to 2018 when only 225,932 licenses were sold.

“The major drivers here are the loss of the baby boomer generation, which is aging out of the hunter ranks as the oldest are now in their mid-70s. This was a huge generation with high participation rates in hunting,” Rusch said. “The subsequent generations are much smaller and have much lower participation rates in hunting, so they are not replacing the attrition in older hunters.”

Rusch added that locally conservation officers are also seeing the trend in firearms safety classes, where bigger towns have traditionally had classes both spring and fall with 30 or more kids in each class.

Today, he said, smaller towns generally have one good-sized class spring or fall.

“Now, many small-town firearms safety classes have folded or combined, and the bigger towns have down-sized to one per year. Some have gone to on-line firearms safety only,” he said.

The survey is mailed to a sample of small game hunters annually and helps the DNR estimate both hunter numbers and harvest by type of small game. The survey provides information that wildlife managers use to monitor populations and inform decisions about seasons, regulations and habitat management.

According to DNR officials, tracking license sales is also important because hunters generate the largest portion of the funding that pays for managing wildlife and their habitats. A continued decline in small game hunting license sales could affect the extent to which the agency can manage wildlife and their habitats in the future.

License sales and resulting harvest estimates reflect an aging hunting population. The DNR has programs to retain hunters and recruit new and lapsed hunters, but they haven’t kept up with the number of hunters leaving the fields.

Contributing to the decline in hunter numbers are many factors including competing activities, time constraints, limited access to hunting lands and changing relationships with the natural world. Amid the challenges, one effective way to recruit and retain hunters is to provide continued mentorship.

Rusch said the shift in population from rural America to the urban centers, larger cities and suburbs is also huge.

“People, including hunters, spend the majority of their free time closest to where they live. When grandma and grandpa no longer live up north or on the farm both an opportunity and place to hunt are lost. Kids that do not grow up in hunting families (parents, grandparents and aunts and uncles) have much lower participation rates in hunting,” he said. “Times change. People have become much more sedentary. Both parents often work. There are more single parent families. Interests change. From social media and digital games to ATVs and OHVs - new opportunities have exploded.

Harvest Results

*Fewer people hunted waterfowl last year than the year before, resulting in fewer state duck stamps being sold and a lower overall harvest. About 614,800 ducks were harvested in 2018, compared to 688,000 ducks in 2017. The Canada goose harvest was 187,600 geese, well below the 2017 harvest of 267,000 geese.

Despite fewer hunters, duck hunter and goose hunter success rates were 89 percent and 77 percent, respectively, which was slightly better than the 10-year averages.*

Implications for the future of conservation

The decline in small game hunter participation translates into an annual average of nearly $1 million dollars less in small game license sales compared to the 1990s. This estimated loss doesn’t account for other hunting-related expenditures including gun and ammunition sales, visits to gas stations and restaurants, and stays at lodging facilities – all things that benefit local economies.

Despite the overall decline in hunter numbers, wildlife conservation remains a core value of Minnesotans. In 2008, Minnesota voters amended the state constitution to support actions that benefit Minnesota’s natural resources. Hunters played a large role in both initiating and supporting this amendment.

The resulting Legacy Amendment increased the sales tax by one-eighth of one percent to protect drinking water sources; to protect, enhance, and restore wetlands, prairies, forests, and fish, game, and wildlife habitat; to preserve arts and cultural heritage; to support parks and trails; and to protect, enhance, and restore lakes, rivers, streams, and groundwater.

The complete small game hunter survey report is on the DNR website.

https://www.mesabitribune.com/opini...cle_05ca0e6a-f860-11e9-a239-fba96b0cf6b8.html


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## KENNEDY63

prairie hunter said:


> DNR is trying to stop the drop in waterfowl stamp sales. Pure recruitment and retention will only be accomplished when the average guy can go shoot a few ducks without being crowded, sworn at, or worse (sprayed/peppered/rained). Urban kids (or even adults) have too many other activities and full weekend (or longer) trips cannot be sustained weekly. Flipp'n travel hockey is an October sport. Rural kids (or adults) have competing activities and getting pushed off (leased land, etc) doesn't help. Add in scouting and the time magnifies considerably.



I've said it for years - rotating rest areas, as opposed to fixed refuges. Easy to implement, easy to enforce. One. Simple. Idea.

And actually - most kids sports are year round these days once a certain age is reached. But if the kids enjoy that more than scanning duckless skies - who can blame them.......

Anywho - we can biotch all we want relative to competing interests - but the fact remains - hunter recruitment in this day and age of expanded opportunities is in the tank. Time for some new experiments, most of which should focus on raising more ducks here, and keeping ducks here as long as possible.


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## RingbillRon

KENNEDY63 said:


> I've said it for years - rotating rest areas, as opposed to fixed refuges. Easy to implement, easy to enforce. One. Simple. Idea.
> 
> And actually - most kids sports are year round these days once a certain age is reached. But if the kids enjoy that more than scanning duckless skies - who can blame them.......
> 
> Anywho - we can biotch all we want relative to competing interests - but the fact remains - hunter recruitment in this day and age of expanded opportunities is in the tank. Time for some new experiments, most of which should focus on raising more ducks here, and keeping ducks here as long as possible.



So in your mind, would the success or failure of the new Teal season be based on hunter numbers decreasing or increasing in 2021?


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## Feathers

Who cares if a teal season brings more people in to the sport and sells more licenses. Hunters should be excited to get a crack at the teal before a majority migrate through our state by regular opener.

If you think it’ll ruin your regular opener you probably aren’t much of a duck hunter.


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## prairie hunter

Not so much that it was an early morning or day, but waterfowl trips often required longer commitments. It also becomes a little more difficult when your kids friends do not hunt.

Grew up in ND and all my kids did the vast majority of their school age hunting back "home". The 4-5 day adventure was a mix of waterfowl and upland based on the weather and populations ... rarely went on MEA (did sometimes) so they also got to miss school. Seeing birds and getting plenty of shots was rarely an issue. Single day trips in MN were almost never waterfowl ... grouse or pheasants was simpler. Suppose we could have hired a guide, but that really did not cross my mind ...


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## prairie hunter

Moist soil management would attract and hold ducks - even in northern tier states.

Ever notice that areas of MN, WI, or the Dakotas that get massive fall rain ... get and retain plenty of ducks.


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## prairie hunter

KENNEDY63 said:


> If that is the case (and I agree with your sentiment) - then why aren't those guys paying more in the form of enhanced license fees? The DNR is always looking for more revenue.....hence the drive for "hunter recruitment".



Agree. Let's start with this: A guide should have to purchase a Federal license ... say $500. An outfitter should have to purchase a Federal license say $2500 - $10K depending on # of clients.


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## Beaverpond

prairie hunter said:


> Moist soil management would attract and hold ducks - even in northern tier states.
> 
> Ever notice that areas of MN, WI, or the Dakotas that get massive fall rain ... get and retain plenty of ducks.


So like lake drawdowns and variable crest dams? We already do that.


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## Bullet21XD

KENNEDY63 said:


> If that is the case (and I agree with your sentiment) - then why aren't those guys paying more in the form of enhanced license fees? The DNR is always looking for more revenue.....hence the drive for "hunter recruitment".



Well...they are. You have to buy an additional license for the extra goose seasons.

I'm expecting the DNR to also add a teal license. Maybe, maybe not.


----------



## Bullet21XD

prairie hunter said:


> Moist soil management would attract and hold ducks - even in northern tier states.
> 
> Ever notice that areas of MN, WI, or the Dakotas that get massive fall rain ... get and retain plenty of ducks.



You mean, when everything is freshly flooded and there's ducks literally everywhere!!

The DNR has tried their hand at MS projects. All that i've seen have been failures. It's not a "one and done" undertaking, in which the DNR is notorious. Every project has become a mostly dry, cattail choked, wasteland. Complete lack of maintenance...utter laziness. It really is proof they aren't in the waterfowl business.


----------



## prairie hunter

Bullet21XD said:


> You mean, when everything is freshly flooded and there's ducks literally everywhere!!
> 
> The DNR has tried their hand at MS projects. All that i've seen have been failures. It's not a "one and done" undertaking, in which the DNR is notorious. Every project has become a mostly dry, cattail choked, wasteland. Complete lack of maintenance...utter laziness. It really is proof they aren't in the waterfowl business.



Yep - they sure messed that one up didn't they.


----------



## KENNEDY63

RingbillRon said:


> So in your mind, would the success or failure of the new Teal season be based on hunter numbers decreasing or increasing in 2021?



Not an all or nothing exercise - but I'm guessing you know that.

So let's get back to the larger picture - can anyone point me in the direction of any evidence that "increased opportunities" (nice euphemism) have enhanced hunter recruitment, harvest, or lead to more hunter based conservation funds being raised?


----------



## KENNEDY63

Feathers said:


> Who cares if a teal season brings more people in to the sport and sells more licenses. Hunters should be excited to get a crack at the teal before a majority migrate through our state by regular opener.
> 
> If you think it’ll ruin your regular opener you probably aren’t much of a duck hunter.



I certainly can't fault the first part of your response. - although I could really care less, as we have historically shot quite a few teal on prior openers (and the weeks that followed) - and they had fewer pin feathers than these new targets will.....

The second part is just a display in intellectual ineptitude - "If you don't agree with me, you must not be much of a (insert activity here).  Weak man.....


----------



## KENNEDY63

prairie hunter said:


> Agree. Let's start with this: A guide should have to purchase a Federal license ... say $500. An outfitter should have to purchase a Federal license say $2500 - $10K depending on # of clients.



Maybe.

But the real money lies in having those who use the resource the most pay their fair share. Since 80% of the ducks are shot by 20% of the hunters - I would prefer to see a tagging system. You shoot a possession limit - you buy a new duck stamp.

Institute that along with the rotating rest areas and we would have a good start.....


----------



## Paul Myrdahl

I'm getting awfully sick if hearing them words, " pay their fair share." I buy a license. The rules say I'm allowed to have so many in possession. If I eat some I'm allowed to shoot more. It's not my fault I can eat and shoot more ducks than you! But, but, but it's not fair. Why does fair have anything to do with it. Sounds like my woman's 4 year old grand daughter.


----------



## RingbillRon

KENNEDY63 said:


> Maybe.
> 
> But the real money lies in having those who use the resource the most pay their fair share. Since 80% of the ducks are shot by 20% of the hunters - I would prefer to see a tagging system. You shoot a possession limit - you buy a new duck stamp.
> 
> Institute that along with the rotating rest areas and we would have a good start.....



Personally, I would like this path better than focusing everything on hunter recruitment. Big fan of resting areas as well.

Another idea to improve things is take a spot like Rice lake in Savage/Bloomington. Build 4 permanent blinds out there and do a draw for those blinds and limit the hunting to weekends and Wednesdays. It would turn into a decent spot with productive hunts instead of the mess it is right now. I am sure there are plenty of other areas where this could be done. Charge for the draw which could cover all cost.


----------



## prairie hunter

*MN will do everything they can to stop the bleed (loss of license sales and thus income generation). Look at spring turkey season.*

Not sure if MN has ever published a detailed report on hunter profiles ... I guess to be honest I have not ever looked. I am not sure I even care. I do not see the anti-hunter crowd having any traction what so ever. The anti-gun crowd ... yes they need to be monitored and fought. 

Flipping through cable channels you see all these reality shows featuring animal harvesting (killing) and even trapping a_nd not just on some outdoor channel.
_
The conservation orgs also push hunter recruitment and total numbers ... not sure why since most of these organizations $$ follow the 80:20 rule right ?? Twenty percent of donors account for eighty percent of revenue ??? 

Is hunter recruitment (new hunters and/or hunters with say under 3 years experience) increasing ... but just not at the pace of those leaving the support (death, too frail, lost interest, etc...) ? Or are people bailing and poor recruitment doubling down on numbers lost ??


Average hunter age is getting older ... but this is as much to do with the baby boomer population bubble.


----------



## KENNEDY63

Paul Myrdahl said:


> I'm getting awfully sick if hearing them words, " pay their fair share." I buy a license. The rules say I'm allowed to have so many in possession. If I eat some I'm allowed to shoot more. It's not my fault I can eat and shoot more ducks than you! But, but, but it's not fair. Why does fair have anything to do with it. Sounds like my woman's 4 year old grand daughter.



Sounds like your woman's 4 year old daughter has a bit more sense that than you. 

The business model of the DNR relative to harvest is broken. In what other "business" can you slap down 35 bucks and "take" what amounts to an unlimited amount of a finite product? 

"Hey gas station guy - can I give you $35.00 and get a bottle of Coke (my daily limit) every day for the next 4 months?" This is pretty simple stuff.........


----------



## Paul Myrdahl

KENNEDY63 said:


> Sounds like your woman's 4 year old daughter has a bit more sense that than you.
> 
> The business model of the DNR relative to harvest is broken. In what other "business" can you slap down 35 bucks and "take" what amounts to an unlimited amount of a finite product?
> 
> "Hey gas station guy - can I give you $35.00 and get a bottle of Coke (my daily limit) every day for the next 4 months?" This is pretty simple stuff.........



Oh, ouch that hurt. Unlimited? Pretty sure that's not how it works. They have these things called limits. You know daily and possession. I am allowed to have in my possesion 18 of a variety of ducks at any given time after the 3rd day of the season. At that point I am no longer able to shoot any more until I eat some. Than I can replace the ones I have eaten I don't get to shoot unlimited numbers.
They also have this thing when you buy your license called hip registration. It helps USFWS manage waterfowl harvest. I'm sure you already knew this I just thought I give you a reminder.

Your analogy of the gas station guys is a pretty weak. I don't ask the DNR to let me shoot ducks for $35. They say give us $35 and this is what your allowed to do. If you don't do it that's on you not me. You say broken. I say that's your opinion.


----------



## Pheasantpete

For what it's worth I think all these additional rules actually hurt hunter recruitment. To confusing for a would be new hunter. It'll likely drive away even some experienced hunters.

Will I take advantage of an early Teal season, possibly. Do I think it's a good idea, not sure as of yet but I'm inclined to be against it. I would prefer moving the whole season up by 1 week and keep it as simple as possible. Your kid can learn to hunt with everyone else, we have made things way to easy for them already.

Also eliminate early goose season, just have an extended late season after regular waterfowl season has closed. As far as staying open all day early on, I think that will hurt us later in the season. Give the Ducks a break at mid-day for the first 30 days. If you don't like getting up early find another hobby like bowling.

I'm not worried about fewer duck hunters, that may put less strain on a dwindling resource. If I got to pay more for my stamps, so be it. Ammo costs much more already.


----------



## megasupermagnum

So it really is true. Duck hunters will complain about anything, good or bad. I'm as bad as anyone at that. I really don't understand how anyone can be against this teal season. A bunch of other states do it with no major problems. It isn't about hunter recruitment, or anything like that. For the first time in my life, Minnesota has allowed something just because they should. This teal season exists for the sole reason of getting a crack at teal before the bulk migrate south. It says that right on the DNR website. 

I will not be partaking in the teal season. If things are good, I'll be sitting over bait for bear. If things are great, I'll be making bear sausage.


----------



## Aunt Betty

I have this terrible habit
Kill duh wabbit!
Duck season
Wabbit season 
Duck season ohhhhhhhhh...
Sing it!


----------



## Paul Myrdahl

Pheasantpete said:


> For what it's worth I think all these additional rules actually hurt hunter recruitment. To confusing for a would be new hunter. It'll likely drive away even some experienced hunters.
> 
> Will I take advantage of an early Teal season, possibly. Do I think it's a good idea, not sure as of yet but I'm inclined to be against it. I would prefer moving the whole season up by 1 week and keep it as simple as possible. Your kid can learn to hunt with everyone else, we have made things way to easy for them already.
> 
> Also eliminate early goose season, just have an extended late season after regular waterfowl season has closed. As far as staying open all day early on, I think that will hurt us later in the season. Give the Ducks a break at mid-day for the first 30 days. If you don't like getting up early find another hobby like bowling.
> 
> I'm not worried about fewer duck hunters, that may put less strain on a dwindling resource. If I got to pay more for my stamps, so be it. Ammo costs much more already.



I think you might be missing the point of the early goose season. It is for thinning the resident population before it has a chance to migrate. Trying to keep geese from crapping on people's yards all summer. 
A late season targets the migrating populations out of Manitoba and Ontario.


----------



## prairie hunter

Paul Myrdahl said:


> I think you might be missing the point of the early goose season. It is for thinning the resident population before it has a chance to migrate. Trying to keep geese from crapping on people's yards all summer.
> A late season targets the migrating populations out of Manitoba and Ontario.



True - but most resident geese are pretty safe. Some get killed, but most move back into town or go lunar and stay safe. Some get killed in special hunts and in golf courses if you have that connection. It is only when snow covers the grass in the city parks that drive them back out to the fields.

The molt migrators are vulnerable as they return.

Opening the state to September over water goose hunting may result in ...


----------



## Paul Myrdahl

prairie hunter said:


> Opening the state to September over water goose hunting may result in ...



More resident geese getting killed?


----------



## prairie hunter

Will it ?


----------



## megasupermagnum

prairie hunter said:


> Will it ?



It has been a few years since I tried the early goose season, but I've always found it tough. I never lived in an area that had a ton of geese, and never took it seriously enough to drive the 30 or so miles to get to the good areas. 

I think what water hunting will do is allow more success to those who don't already field hunt geese. You can get away with a lot less gear and investment when water hunting. A dozen silhouettes in a field doesn't really do anything. A dozen goose floaters is at least a huntable spread. I have no idea if this will translate into more geese being killed in the early season or not. It would definitely interest me a lot more, if I still lived in MN.


----------



## Mojo

The following are just my opinions.
I harvest more goose meat during the early season by far. To me, it's working as planned. Local birds get harvested by local hunters before they come back in the spring and reproduce. I don't hunt fields nearly as much as water, been that way my whole life, since before field hunting became the preferred method. Resident geese tend to stay near their nesting area until they start flocking up for the migration, nesting areas are always near water. No brainer for me.
Early season is when the geese are naive, resulting in greater hunter success, which keeps new hunters interested, which keeps the DNR funded, and they in turn, attempt to protect the resource. There are places where the resident goose population has not exploded in the last decade, but that's not the norm in areas where geese are typically found - there are more geese every season despite the more liberal rules. I am not aware of an area in our region where the Canada goose population is in decline. The rules for snow geese have been extremely liberal for over 20 years, yet their numbers remain very high.
I have several decades of hunting experience, and I honestly believe that more hunting opportunity and more hunters actually creates smarter waterfowl. Back in the 80's and 90's I never saw geese in flight that weren't honking, and I never saw flocks flying at night either, and I remember the southern states having enormous migrations. I believe they are learning, adapting and evolving. A couple extra hours of hunting pressure per day won't make any statistical difference. Part of the reason for the increasing Canada goose population, is that geese have learned that areas with human populations can actually be favorable places to nest and raise young. 
There is no good reason MN does not have a statewide season for Sandhill Cranes.


----------



## megasupermagnum

Goose numbers have definitely grown strong over the last 10 years, despite the lack of ducks. Looking back now, I should have done a lot more goose hunting. I would not say they have exploded in numbers everywhere, but in certain areas they are definitely thick. I won't say the specific place online, but there the powerplant near the Mississippi river definitely has a ridiculous number of geese. Other places where I've lived, say Staples, MN had plenty, but it wasn't like the sky was black with them. I would even say I see less geese around Alexandria, MN now, than I did 10 years ago. Yet go a little more west to around Wheaton, and there is goose galore again. 

I too prefer water hunting if I can. I never had the ability to set up a field like some people. Even if I had $1500 in decoys, I don't have the ability to handle those kinds of number myself. I never understood why water hunting wasn't allowed before for the early goose season. I'm glad that is changed. 

About the sandhill cranes, I just checked trail camera photos, and I have a picture of a sandhill crane out in the middle of the woods in some grass the deer eat. This was in Alexandria, MN, well outside what is supposed to be their breeding area. I'll have to check, but I'm fairly sure Aberdeen, SD where I live now is open crane hunting. I've never tried them, but I only hear good things. I'll have to try one this year.


----------



## Matt Jones

The rice is thick this year. I went out ricing today and it was too early. The rice is just barely starting to turn red, and it took some pretty hard thwacks with my ricing sticks to get any grains to drop into the 'ol canoe. So I decided to put them down and uncase the scattergun instead.

This is how thick the rice is this year....

I dropped 32 ducks with their necks and heads going limp, their wings stopping, and their bodies going limp, before falling and hitting the water, making a loud splash that was often also visible, and again, it took me doing this 32 times in order to recover enough of them to feed my cats (12). Usually I only lose about one out of three I drop, but the rice is so thick they're extremely hard to find this year and I'm only retrieving roughly 40% of the ducks I'm killing.

So far the ducks have been flushing up out of the rice at a distance of twenty yards or less, and then setting back down no farther than the same distance (when not being shot at). The type of wingshooting most closely resembles kicking pigeons out of a grain bin more than anything right now.

FYI I married an Ojibwe woman, which allowed me to become a full-fledged Mille Lacs band member. As such, I'm entitled to hunt the area of the state under the 1837 ceded treaty area. I'm exercising my legal rights, and am fully legal in what I've described in my post. I'm not seeing or shooting much for teal yet. Right now I'm shooting mainly wood ducks.

I'm trying to share a report and enjoy some camaraderie amongst fellow duck hunters, and I'm not trying to offend anyone. If I have inadvertently done so, I offer this poignant kernel of wisdom to keep in your thoughts and prayers:

"Don't hate the player---hate the Game."


----------



## Feathers

Your wife’s family is gonna be mad at you. Natives start duck hunting at the start of September. No one likes someone shooting up their ducks weeks before they even start hunting.


----------



## Bullet21XD

Matt Jones said:


> The rice is thick this year. I went out ricing today and it was too early. The rice is just barely starting to turn red, and it took some pretty hard thwacks with my ricing sticks to get any grains to drop into the 'ol canoe. So I decided to put them down and uncase the scattergun instead.
> 
> This is how thick the rice is this year....
> 
> I dropped 32 ducks with their necks and heads going limp, their wings stopping, and their bodies going limp, before falling and hitting the water, making a loud splash that was often also visible, and again, it took me doing this 32 times in order to recover enough of them to feed my cats (12). Usually I only lose about one out of three I drop, but the rice is so thick they're extremely hard to find this year and I'm only retrieving roughly 40% of the ducks I'm killing.
> 
> So far the ducks have been flushing up out of the rice at a distance of twenty yards or less, and then setting back down no farther than the same distance (when not being shot at). The type of wingshooting most closely resembles kicking pigeons out of a grain bin more than anything right now.
> 
> FYI I married an Ojibwe woman, which allowed me to become a full-fledged Mille Lacs band member. As such, I'm entitled to hunt the area of the state under the 1837 ceded treaty area. I'm exercising my legal rights, and am fully legal in what I've described in my post. I'm not seeing or shooting much for teal yet. Right now I'm shooting mainly wood ducks.
> 
> I'm trying to share a report and enjoy some camaraderie amongst fellow duck hunters, and I'm not trying to offend anyone. If I have inadvertently done so, I offer this poignant kernel of wisdom to keep in your thoughts and prayers:
> 
> "Don't hate the player---hate the Game."


Sounds like some sweet action! Can you take friends??

Asking for a friend...


----------



## Matt Jones

Feathers said:


> Your wife’s family is gonna be mad at you. Natives start duck hunting at the start of September. No one likes someone shooting up their ducks weeks before they even start hunting.


What family? Her dad's dead, her mom has type II diabetes and can barely walk, her two full brothers have both died within the last five years from the opiod/heroin/smack epidemic, her one half brother is in jail, her full blood sister has been missing for two years, and her half sister who's her only sibling we see on a somewhat regular basis doesn't hunt.

None of the natives hunt. Have you seen what most of my people wear these days? They look like the closest thing to being in a rap video you could get when you're only clothing options are what you can steal from a Dollar General. I tried to start a native version of the Boy Scouts hoping to teach our youth how to learn to tie knots (for netting), how to make spears, and the time honored way our people have harvested and processed mahnomen but none of them are interested. Occasionally I'll get a kid or two that will come pull nets and then bring the bounty the Great Spirit bestowed on us to some of the elders but those days are few and far between.

I appreciate your concern over me keeping things on the up and up with my family but don't worry about it. I'd tell you that you need to worry about keeping your family happy as well, but amongst my people such an assertion is the worst insult another man can give another man. It usually results in the man who said it having to spend a hot weekend in the sweat lodge after the elders converse amongst themselves before offering up their verdict.

The waterfowl seasons and really any of our hunting "seasons" that put dates on the white man's twelve sheets of paper with boxes marked with seven recurring names and sequential numbers---those "dates" are nothing more than an informal courtesy from my people. Sure, our elders gave the USFWS some random moons we will hunt waterfowl, but we hunt them many moons.

It's similar to telling your neighbor that you'll mow and water his lawn when he's out of town, or pick up his mail and newspaper, or let his dogs out twice a day and also feed and water them----sure, you said you'd do it but there's nothing they can do to you if you end up choosing to not do it. My people don't view having to honor our informal agreements with the USFWS or any other part of the US Government as a very high priority. It's not like they've never reneged on their end of a lot of our past agreements. As such, we actually value not honoring those agreements more than we value honoring them.

In the end, no legal oversight or authorities exist that govern you that also govern me. Me and my people will always accept the bounty the Great Spirit & Mother Mahnomen bestow upon us when they choose to give us their gifts. That's what ultimately determines when I hunt and fish, instead of some random dates and numbers we flippantly told the USFWS just to get them to shut up.


----------



## Bullet21XD




----------



## Matt Jones

Bullet21XD said:


> Sounds like some sweet action! Can you take friends??
> 
> Asking for a friend...


Sure, as long as you bring lots of shells and are a halfway decent shot. If you can't drop five out of the first ten that get up within twenty yards I'm bringing you back to the put-in. I recommend 7.5 low brass target loads and absolutely nothing tighter than a modified for a choke. Remember that when shooting lead you naturally drop a choke size, so shooting a modified would be like shooting an improved cylinder with steel.

If you're single I can do you one better and set you up with my half-sister. She looks a lot like my wife---butt ugly and obese, which isn't bad. Most women are morbidly obese, and I'm talking whether native, white, black, brown, whatever.

Most marriages are done for convenience. I figured if I'm going to get married and have to deal with some woman who progressively becomes more and more ill-tempered as the number on the scale keeps going up and up over the years----I might as well get some kickazz hunting and fishing perks out of the deal versus marrying a white chick and getting nothing.


----------



## Matt Jones

Before anyone accuses me as being someone who only takes from the resource and doesn't give back, allow me to share my most successful conservation initiative. It was 100% me who conceived it and spearheaded getting it off the ground. It's called:

"R4R&R"

"Recycling for the Resource and Reuniting"

With the low lake levels on Mille Lacs and other bodies of water in the 1837 treaty area it has been extremely difficult to get our youth into spearing. Often times we're wading out from shore a hundred yards or more, at night, with head lights, in icy cold spring waters. There were guys wading out over a quarter mile this past spring on Mille Lacs to spear spawning walleyes for instance.

Imagine being a ten year old? Think of how scary that would be if you were that young?

What my program has done is raise awareness through a public campaign on the reservation that encourages people to do the right thing. Instead of my people throwing their unwanted trash, old appliances, and stuff cluttering up their homes in the ditch off 169 it gets them to donate it for use of improving the resource.

I dig holes where I can close to shore and then sink these unwanted items in them to create fish habitat. This new habitat ensures enough walleyes come in close to shore to spawn where our youth are able to spear them.

You wouldn't believe how many walleyes kids speared next to this old smoker and piece of exercise equipment this past spring. The program has been so successful that it's often been hard for me to get enough recycled garbage to keep up with the demand and I've been forced to cut down hardwoods and start sinking them, which I don't mind doing because I'll do whatever I can to ensure the bounty of the resource along with our cultural heritage gets passed down to our youth. I'm not big on using trees because they'll rot whereas old appliances will be around for future generations to enjoy, but it's a practical band-aid that'll work until I get my hands on more large trash items.


----------



## Matt Jones




----------



## snowgooseman

Sad


----------



## Matt Jones

snowgooseman said:


> Sad


Tell me about it. I wish more people recycled too.


----------



## Matt Jones

What sucks is that right now is the hardest time of the year to get my hands on the absolute best fish habitat there is----a mini fridge with the door taken off of them.

All it takes is one decent rock placed inside to sink them. I put 'em under on their side so fish can get in and out of them; they're the cream of the crop and the absolute best thing I've found for the type of habitat improvement I'm doing, hands down.

With all the college kids getting geared up to go back to school good luck finding one right now though. Even the oldest crappiest ones with their compressors pretty much all the way shot have got a date with some kid's dorm room a week or two from now.

But with all things, for every action there's an equal but opposite reaction I suppose. This is the "yang" to last year's "yin."

Because of covid and in-person classes being canceled you wouldn't believe how many mini-fridges I got my hands on last spring. All the college kids staying home = me sinking A LOT of mini-fridges = lots of native kids spearing lots of walleyes close to shore = the passing down of our time-honored sacred traditions.

Good Stuff!


----------



## prairie hunter

Mille Lacs band should be able to sell the walleye in the Twin Cities or maybe flash frozen fillets at the two casinos. Why should that walleye fillet business all go to Canada ?


----------



## KENNEDY63

Matt Jones said:


> What sucks is that right now is the hardest time of the year to get my hands on the absolute best fish habitat there is----a mini fridge with the door taken off of them.
> 
> All it takes is one decent rock placed inside to sink them. I put 'em under on their side so fish can get in and out of them; they're the cream of the crop and the absolute best thing I've found for the type of habitat improvement I'm doing, hands down.
> 
> With all the college kids getting geared up to go back to school good luck finding one right now though. Even the oldest crappiest ones with their compressors pretty much all the way shot have got a date with some kid's dorm room a week or two from now.
> 
> But with all things, for every action there's an equal but opposite reaction I suppose. This is the "yang" to last year's "yin."
> 
> Because of covid and in-person classes being canceled you wouldn't believe how many mini-fridges I got my hands on last spring. All the college kids staying home = me sinking A LOT of mini-fridges = lots of native kids spearing lots of walleyes close to shore = the passing down of our time-honored sacred traditions.
> 
> Good Stuff!






Dude - this stuff is classic!

You ever hear of Brockett 99?


----------



## Matt Jones

prairie hunter said:


> Mille Lacs band should be able to sell the walleye in the Twin Cities or maybe flash frozen fillets at the two casinos. Why should that walleye fillet business all go to Canada ?


I appreciate the empathy, support, and positive nature of your thoughtful response towards my people, but I respectfully disagree.

For starters, there's a slight misconception between where the walleye that is sold and purchased at market comes from. Technically you're right in stating it is from Canada, but personally I view it in two categories.

1. Erie
2. Canada

Again, Technically it's the Canadian side of Lake Erie, the largest freshwater commercial fishery in the world, which pumps out tens of millions of pounds of walleye annually. I don't have the stats in front of me but I'm pretty sure Erie will do fifty million of the hundred million pounds of walleye that is commercially caught, processed, and sold each and every year.

I know it's the Canadian side this takes place on but mentally I view Erie as a US sport fishery, because it is. Keep in mind that Erie is a big lake, but not that big. It's only 47 times the size of Mille Lacs.

Side note: never ever ever say "Lake Mille Lacs" unless you're a complete moron. "Lacs" is French for Lake. So saying "Lake Mille Lacs" is similar to some idiot asking where he can find an, "ATM Machine."

So Erie makes up half of the walleye commercial fishery that is North America for walleye harvest. Where does the other half come from?

Good Question!

A: All Over

Most of it comes from Western Ontario and then Manitoba (#1 I believe after Erie), Saskatchewan, and to a lesser extent Alberta. There are a lot of fish processing plants in places similar to Kenora, on the North end of Lake of the Woods, which processes a couple million pounds of walleye every year. Lake Winnipeg has multiple FPP (fish processing plants; "You down with FPP!? Yeah, You Know Me!") that were doing about three to five million annually but have actually overharvested the resource and have been producing dwindling numbers over the past decade.

Now that you have a better understanding of the North American commercial walleye fishery I'll bring it back to my people and Mdewakanton. Mdewakaton being the Dakota word for "Spirit Lake." Wahkon, Onamia, Kathio, Vineland, etc., were all Sioux villages. They inhabited the area around "Spirit Lake" for many moons. That is until the late 1700's when my people came in and massacred those Snakes and drove them out of our beloved woods and off our waters and out to the dirty and dusty prairie. Me and my people loathe the Sioux because they're nothing but a bunch of snake rat *******s. They're the only tribe that started crap with Lewis & Clark for instance.

Anyways, my people don't want to commercially harvest the Spirit Lake. As Ashinabe we came from the lake, we were born from it, and as such we must protect it.

We just want to see the lake in it's best version of itself as possible for all people, native and white alike, to enjoy.

There's a hundred million pounds of walleye commercially harvested every year.

Why would we give a hoot about selling what? Maybe 10,000lbs to 20,000lbs? For that small amount it's pointless. It'd be like becoming a drug dealer in order to sell a teener of crank once a month. The juice absolutely isn't worth the squeeze, especially when you own and operate multiple casinos that are literally, not essentially, money machines. Unfortunately most of that money goes back out East to New Jersey to the mob, but that's another story for another day.

If I was an Arab I would know all about the oil market and supply chain, but I'm not. I'm a native, so I know all about the walleye market and supply chain. If you have any questions please don't be afraid to ask. I love educating thd white man about the greatness of my people.


----------



## SkolMNDuckHunter

Matt Jones said:


> I'm a native, so I know all about the walleye market and supply chain. If you have any questions please don't be afraid to ask. I love educating thd white man about the greatness of my people.


I don't have anything against what you've said pertaining to hunting, fishing, or the greatness of native people, but I swear you said somewhere in here that you married in. 

Are you also white, or did you marry into the tribe already having native blood?


----------



## Matt Jones

SkolMNDuckHunter said:


> I don't have anything against what you've said pertaining to hunting, fishing, or the greatness of native people, but I swear you said somewhere in here that you married in.
> 
> Are you also white, or did you marry into the tribe already having native blood?


I'm similar to the one they call "Sunkmanitu Tanka Ob Waci."

That's a joke.

That's Kevin Costner's character's name, which is also the name of the film in which he appears; 'Dances With Wolves.'

I would never identify myself with anyone who would align themselves with the Lakota, Nakota, or Dakota, the three bands that make up the Dakotah tribe. I hate those loathsome snake rat basturds.

Back in 1794 I was a great Chippewa warrior. My people had been forced West from Michigan and Wisconsin and I'd fought to invade Minnesota, and instantly fell in love with my new home. I had a beautiful wife who was pregnant with our third child. We had settled by Kathio and made a happy home there living amongst my people. A lot of blood was shed back and forth between my people and the Sioux in order for this new home to be possible.

We had successfully eradicated most of the snakes from the region, but a few remnant random small war parties of their evil ilk remained on the day I went out with some of my brethren in a hunting party to procure meat for our people back at our new Kathio encampment/village. While we were out hunting my brother, the bear, appeared and warned me of imminent heart break and pain. I rode back to camp so fast I almost killed my horse. That's where I found my murdered family. The Sioux had torn them to pieces. Like the Sioux were known to do, they cut the fetus out of my wife, grabbed my screaming, crying, soon to be born daughter by her legs, and swung her into a tree in front of my still alive wife. They smashed her against a tree and then slit my wife's throat and scalped her and my other two children.

My spirit was blackened and my heart was filled with rage. I abandoned the dignity of my people to the disappointment of the Great Spirit. I became evil. I became just like the snakes I hated. I went on my blood quest for revenge.

I brutally murdered and killed more Sioux women and children than can be counted; they numbered like the stars in the night sky. Instead of healing my blackened evil spirit it only rotted it further.

When I finally died with a Sioux arrow in my chest and leg, still alive and looking up as they scalped me, as I spit in the face of my conqeuer before he sheared the top of my head with his blade, the Great Spirit whispered to me, "For all the grave sins you've done to shame your people you will be reborn at the bottom and need to work your way back up living in peace and harmony during each life before you can leap up to the next."

I woke up as a daphnia, a water flea, but I was a good water flea before being eaten by a minnow. Then I was a noble minnow before being eaten by a perch. Then I lived in peace and harmony before being eaten by a walleye. Then eaten by a muskie before becoming a muskie, a small muskie eaten by a raccoon, then a raccoon eaten by a eagle, and this all went on many times for many moons. Sometimes I wasn't able to live in peace and harmony living as what I was and had to start over.

Eventually our creator, the Great Spirit, put my spirit in the body of a pale face. The body is only a vessel for the spirit. As such, I might look like a white man but I'm native. It's 2021 and men now identify as women. The Great Spirit in all his wisdom knew this as he placed me on this path and knew that my spirit would be able to find it's way back to my people.....even as a white man in the year 2021.

Thus, as part of my punishment I have to live in a body of a white man, no offense, but I'm grateful to the Great Spirit for allowing me the opportunity to finally reunite with my people, at long last, I breathe a sigh of relief finally being able to rejoin my people.

The short answer to your question:

I'm native. Call me Ashinabe, Chippewa, or Ojibwe. Tomato. Tomatoe.


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## SkolMNDuckHunter

Matt Jones said:


> Thus, as part of my punishment I have to live in a body of a white man


Yea out of all of that, that's the part I was looking for. You're quite the story weaver, and I understand that you can be granted tribal membership due to your marriage, but forgive me if it all feels a little "high horse"ish to read what you've written knowing the author was born with same white butt I was. 

Because you married a tribal member in this life, that means you were a native in a prior life? OK.


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## prairie hunter

I have read about three lines of Matt's essays. 

If you want to hear it in person go here ....

https://www.mnhs.org/millelacs

Some pretty interesting history. Sometimes your most significant enemy is within your own people.


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## SkolMNDuckHunter

prairie hunter said:


> I have read about three lines of Matt's essays.
> 
> If you want to hear it in person go here ....
> 
> https://www.mnhs.org/millelacs
> 
> Some pretty interesting history. Sometimes your most significant enemy is within your own people.


Oh I have no doubt the actual tribal history is fascinating. I just find this white dude's claim of being some long lost native spirit with actual warrior memories to be pretty shaky considering he has the same white European ancestors we do. He married in, got tribal membership, and now gets cool hunting perks. The rest I would label politely as hogwash.


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## prairie hunter

Matt has been around a long time and he be trolling. Bullet and a few others be rolling ...


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## SkolMNDuckHunter

prairie hunter said:


> Matt has been around a long time and he be trolling. Bullet and a few others be rolling ...
> View attachment 303954
> 
> 
> View attachment 303955


 well in that case, Bravo Matt. You got to much time on your hands


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## snowgooseman

It's all hogwash


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## Bullet21XD

I enjoy reading about a white dude assimilating!


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## Matt Jones

prairie hunter said:


> Matt has been around a long time


True, 1794 wasn't exactly "recently."


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## Matt Jones

snowgooseman said:


> It's all hogwash


I'm not following. What's hogwash? The bathwater after my wife gets out of the tub?

Sounds about right to me. You're not going to see me try to argue with you on that one.


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## Bullet21XD




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## Pheasantpete

If you could only get someone to print that in a book you might have a bestseller but the Woke won't allow it. Not even for a spirit warrior like Matt.

And I think many Ojibwe would enjoy more than many whites still trapped by bad spirits, other white SJW's speaking for those they oppress.


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